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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:38 pm 
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revolting kitty
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From a forum discussion on the FF System: "There is also a hazard with this system. Imagine dropping the chain or getting your socks or trousers stuck into the chain. With a normal bike, you stop pedalling and the chain stops moving. Not here."


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:46 pm 
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That's no worse than a fixed gear bike, but could mean some measures should be taken to avoid it, and to save the RD.
A valid point though.


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:50 pm 
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revolting kitty
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The Shimano Front Freewheel (FFS) was a proprietary bicycle drivetrain design of the 1970s that placed a freewheel between the pedal cranks and the front chainrings — enabling the rider to shift gears while coasting.[1] FFS retained the typical rear freewheel to stop the chain in the event of, for example, a clothing tangle — which could otherwise lead to injuries of the leg by the drivetrain, crashing of the bicycle, or both.
FFS marketing followed Shimano's then-current path of beginning with lower-cost implementations of the system using low tech and usually heavier materials. The resulting system was substantially heavier than the standard freewheel and, in any event, did not penetrate the market noticeably, although Panasonic, Ross, and Raleigh briefly equipped bicycles with FFS. The late Sheldon Brown, noted bicycle authority, called FFS a "solution in search of a problem."[2]
Non-proprietary front freewheels can currently be found on bikes used for bike trials riding.


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:51 pm 
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revolting kitty
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I like the "solution in search of a problem" thing. I guess the question is, do you buy a new hub or a new BB?


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:03 pm 
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pussy
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Magura wrote:
That's no worse than a fixed gear bike, but could mean some measures should be taken to avoid it, and to save the RD.
A valid point though.


I think that I have read somewhere that as a safety measure designed to mitigate those risks , the rear hubs actually had a freewheel too, only it was much more resistant to spinning than the BB freewheel.


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 2:50 pm 
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revolting kitty
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Sti wrote:
Magura wrote:
That's no worse than a fixed gear bike, but could mean some measures should be taken to avoid it, and to save the RD.
A valid point though.


I think that I have read somewhere that as a safety measure designed to mitigate those risks , the rear hubs actually had a freewheel too, only it was much more resistant to spinning than the BB freewheel.


Yes, from what I'm reading, that is the case, although, I'm not confident it is necessary. My big question is whether or not moving the freewheel to the front will be less complicated than what SRAM has already come up with. Also, will the general MTB public accept it?


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 3:04 pm 
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Wmac wrote:
Sti wrote:
Magura wrote:
That's no worse than a fixed gear bike, but could mean some measures should be taken to avoid it, and to save the RD.
A valid point though.


I think that I have read somewhere that as a safety measure designed to mitigate those risks , the rear hubs actually had a freewheel too, only it was much more resistant to spinning than the BB freewheel.


Yes, from what I'm reading, that is the case, although, I'm not confident it is necessary. My big question is whether or not moving the freewheel to the front will be less complicated than what SRAM has already come up with. Also, will the general MTB public accept it?


It will make it possible to go 8 teeth in the rear, which in turn makes the chain ring smaller for a comparable drive train.

As to if the general MTB public will accept it? :text-lol:
As to if I might like it? :dance:
As to if it will be available to the general MTB public? :whistle:

Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:10 pm 
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revolting kitty
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Hopefully it will eventually be available to the general MTB public. So, would you just use a trials freewheel BB with a bigger chainring?


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:54 pm 
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Wmac wrote:
Hopefully it will eventually be available to the general MTB public. So, would you just use a trials freewheel BB with a bigger chainring?


I think I will take a trials freewheel, and modify it with a XX1 style ring.
That seems like an easy solution, and I've grown to like those Echo freewheels. I use them on my trials bikes, and even on my DJ as well. My brain has grown used to waiting for a click for confirmation of engagement, and those 108 point Echo's are having a very distinctive sound to them, without being extremely noisy.
...well this, and that I get them for asking ;)


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:18 pm 
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pussy
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Inspiration possibly?


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 8:49 pm 
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revolting kitty
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^Is that for a moped conversion?


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:19 pm 
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LOL, not too far from what I have in mind. I plan to make it ever so slightly more elegant though ;)


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 9:26 pm 
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pussy
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Magura wrote:
LOL, not too far from what I have in mind. I plan to make it ever so slightly more elegant though ;)


LOL, that is a classic "good enough" design indeed! :lol:

It would be cool if you could start with a splined SRAM crank, install the freewheel with ring mounting tabs in place of a spider and then use regular or special Mr. Magura MM1 chainrings. Not going to happen, I know, but it is a nice dream. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:26 pm 
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bad kitty!
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Sti wrote:
Magura wrote:
LOL, not too far from what I have in mind. I plan to make it ever so slightly more elegant though ;)


LOL, that is a classic "good enough" design indeed! :lol:

It would be cool if you could start with a splined SRAM crank, install the freewheel with ring mounting tabs in place of a spider and then use regular or special Mr. Magura MM1 chainrings. Not going to happen, I know, but it is a nice dream. ;)


It's gonna be even more "available" than the Sram cranks:

http://www.tartybikes.co.uk/cranks_pair ... 12016.html

Mounted on this:

http://www.tartybikes.co.uk/isis_spline ... 11117.html

Fairly cheap, readily available, and lighter than anything Sram has to offer to the world.


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 10:28 pm 
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bad kitty!
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BTW, just finished building up my new trials bike.
Will post pics tomorrow.
It turned out real nice, and is sure sub 8kg. A guesstimate would be 7.7kg or there about.


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Wed Feb 20, 2013 11:29 pm 
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revolting kitty
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"- Only suitable for use with Echo, Adamant and Czar 24" frames, plus 2011 Echo and ZOO! trials frames with press in bearing system (without threads)."


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 8:23 am 
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bad kitty!
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Wmac wrote:
"- Only suitable for use with Echo, Adamant and Czar 24" frames, plus 2011 Echo and ZOO! trials frames with press in bearing system (without threads)."


Until you throw in a MM1 BB adapter ;)

Cranks, BB, bearings, and adapter, will still be sub 600g if my calcs are not too far off.


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2013 11:17 am 
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bad kitty!
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Magura wrote:
BTW, just finished building up my new trials bike.
Will post pics tomorrow.
It turned out real nice, and is sure sub 8kg. A guesstimate would be 7.7kg or there about.


Magura :)


http://www.huckingkitty.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=223&p=3320#p3320

Link to pics.


Magura :)

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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 4:12 am 
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revolting kitty
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This thread is on page 3. We need to keep talking about this!


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 Post subject: Re: Moving the freehub
PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:53 am 
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bad kitty!
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Naah, it's time for some action, but I'm short of time at the moment.


Magura :)

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